Declined Making a cheaper permanent "reward-able" donate option.

[Red]

We've all always considered at some point, to donate some money to our favorite TF2 community.
However, when some took a look at their available options for donating, they were dissatisfied.

At the moment, if you wish to receive any of the VIP perks on Wonderland.tf's servers, you may either do it, by donating 6€ per month or by permanently donating 40€.

The 6€ option (VIP), is often not satisfying, as you only receive it for an objectively short amount of time. Especially if you consider the fact that most donors of any videogame community, are active members in that community.

The 40€ option (VIP+), is in most cases not affordable. Looking at how you only earn 6 different features, compared to VIP, 2 of which are specific to 1 game mode (Jailbreak) and 2 others hardly make a difference (RTD, Trails; most don't even notice).

Don't get me wrong, VIP features are meant to be a reward for donating, people spammed this at me when I made a "similar" suggestion, but what happens to those who want to permanently access some of the VIP features, and simultaneously want to support the community without having to donate 40€?
They're sadly left with no choice.


What do I suggest?
The Wonderland staff team should create a new rank, which will replace VIP+, perhaps an MVP.
Whoever owned VIP+ before the change, will automatically earn MVP

The new VIP+ will cost 18€ or 20€, will give permanent access to all the VIP features, and MAYBE 2 of the VIP+ features (which will be decided by the donor individually, or by the team as a whole. I'd suggest no ads and the reserved slot).

It is of my belief, that through the creation of this rank, there would be a donate option, that would balance satisfaction and affordability. That way, more users would be motivated to donate.

 

[Green.]

I don't see anything wrong with it so I'mma give it a +1

 

[Toxic]

I'd give it a +1 / one of the reasons I havn't donated is because I don't really have the money to. Making an alternative choice would help out the people who wouldn't have enough money to buy VIP+ in the first place.

 

[Redds]

You dont buy VIP. But lets see outside of that. VIP are rewards you get for donating you dont have to donate. Yes I would like to but I dont have the money. Maybe I remember a sale has happened in the past which was successful? Um for now for this idea of a cheaper vip+, just save up some money if you want to donate. -1.

 

[Coal]

-1

 

[Red]

You dont buy VIP. But lets see outside of that. VIP are rewards you get for donating you dont have to donate. Yes I would like to but I dont have the money. Maybe I remember a sale has happened in the past which was successful? Um for now for this idea of a cheaper vip+, just save up some money if you want to donate. -1.

Don't you realize that the high price of VIP+ at the moment is seriously discouraging people from donating?
Nobody under 18 can "save money" to get VIP+ for the simple reason that they do not have a credit card.
Will their parents donate 40EU to some "random online community"? Fat chance, buddy.

I myself wanted to get VIP+, but it is too expensive.
I also considered getting default VIP, until I realized it requires a monthly payment of 6EU.

After asking my parents, they told me that they'd only donate a maximum of 15EU anywhere, even if that was a charity or a satanic church.

Explain this to me right now.
Even if you have 40EU in cash money, and you really want to donate to Wonderland.
How exactly are you planning to convert that money to PayPal?

You can't just grab your mother's credit card, slap it onto a PayPal account, and then buy whatever you want.
That is unless you're being spoiled... but that's another story.

 

[Kyo]

My opinion about the price is that 40€ means that you are willing to support the community and not abusing the featured commands, if you abused it and removed you on VIP, you've wasted your money.

If it drops 18€ or 20€, there will be a small chance to make people abuse the commands.

-1

 

[Red]

My opinion about the price is that 40€ means that you are willing to support the community and not abusing the featured commands, if you abused it and removed you on VIP, you've wasted your money.

If it drops 18€ or 20€, there will be a small chance to make people abuse the commands.

-1

If there's a small chance, then why bother?
Most commands VIP provides you cannot be abused (exceptions are lasers, voting rights and resizing).
And frankly, if the Wonderland team doesn't want them to be abused, they might as well tweak them.
Or completely remove the "abusable" commands from the suggested VIP+ perk.

I'm not asking to drop the price of VIP+ to 18€. I simply suggested renaming the rank to MVP, then recreating VIP+ in a way where you'd have permanent access to all VIP's perks.

 

[Redds]

Remove the abusable commands seems far. Mostly all of them can be. You give a man a god damn watermelon and tell him to kill for 1000 bucks. He will find a way.

 

[Red]

Remove the abusable commands seems far. Mostly all of them can be. You give a man a god damn watermelon and tell him to kill for 1000 bucks. He will find a way.

Alright.. fair point.

Can you explain how exactly you can abuse the following?

• Pet Summoning
• Credits
• Projectile Customisation
• Tauntspeed Modification
• Bumpercarts
• Extra credits
• Player color

 

[Redds]

Bumpecarts kill. Tauntspeed you can mess a lot of frame and other strange things.

 

[Red]

Bumpecarts kill. Tauntspeed you can mess a lot of frame and other strange things.

Bumpercarts can kill, but it's extremely difficult and punishable.
The tauntspeed claim is too vague.

What about the rest?

 

[Hypernova]

no

 

[Redds]

All abusing is punishable? Just a simple no for me. Maybe a sale but thats it.

 

[MissMaye]

Alright.. fair point.

Can you explain how exactly you can abuse the following?

• Pet Summoning
• Credits
• Projectile Customisation
• Tauntspeed Modification
• Bumpercarts
• Extra credits
• Player color

1) Pet Summoning: There's nothing abusable about this. Cloaking as spy suspends the pet in one location and that's it.
2) Credits: Not abusable. Having paid for a rank, a very small boost in credits gained is given.
3) Proj custom: Not exploitable. The only thing that comes from it is a trail that might be hard to see past for a split second.
4) Tauntspeed Modification: Not exploitable. At a certain speed cap, Taunts stop showing their movement and have the player model move at its speed in default standing pose.
5) Bumpercars: Stated above.

6) Extra credits: Covered in answer 2 ^
7) Player color: Not exploitable. Very slight disadvantage if you're blind because not even recoloring self to black hides you in the shadiest parts of a map.

None of these things are abusable.

Granted, I see your point, nobody's made of money. In hindsight, if this suggestion had been made like, 2 years ago, it'd have a better chance at success. It has, however, been such a long time since the current system of vip was implemented, and the number of people who purchased VIP+ already will feel put out at the inclusion of some other form of VIP.

Also.

Can you explain how exactly you can abuse the following?

This is bad in any context. Asking how to perform exploits on anything, in any party of wln, is asking for trouble. Abusing systems/game mechanics/perks are stricly disallowed and I suggest avoiding asking questions like this.

 

[Aldash]

+1

 

[Red]

It has, however, been such a long time since the current system of vip was implemented, and the number of people who purchased VIP+ already will feel put out at the inclusion of some other form of VIP.

I see where you're coming from; people who spent the whole 40€ for the old VIP+ would be upset, due to not having the opportunity to purchase the new VIP+ in the past.

In response to that, a great idea would be to add more perks to the MVP rank, such as maybe Death Priority on DR, Saxton Priority on VSH, Building Hat Customization for Engineer (including unusuals?), Human Priority on ZE, Medigun beam & healing particle customization, cloaking animation customization (if that's even possible) and other things that would discourage the player who donated for MVP from having such thoughts.

This is bad in any context. Asking how to perform exploits on anything, in any party of wln, is asking for trouble. Abusing systems/game mechanics/perks are strictly disallowed and I suggest avoiding asking questions like this.

I apologize if this question sounded off, but I simply wanted a further explanation of Redd's claim. I have no desire to abuse any in-game mechanics or systems. Knowing how bad it is, I'll refrain from asking it again.

 

[Jasmine]

I'm going to stay as unbiased as possible with this.

Yes some people can't/struggle to afford the 40 euros.
Yes some younger community members won't be able to pay through paypal.

However, despite there being non-abusable perks with VIP+, the abusable one's are pretty substantial, being able to vote-kick and vote-ban a player is a VERY abusable thing.

As Kyo has mentioned, a lower price means there's more chance of abusing those perks when it's cheaper and doesn't matter as much.
The higher price, in my eyes, helps discourage people from abusing their perks.

I would personally say, if you're donating for the perks, don't donate.
I personally think the price is fine. Granted I may be biased in this area since I am 18 years old and work part-time.

Now to have my biased VIP+ opinion, the entire "make VIP+ a new MVP tag, but give people all the VIP perks for 20 euro" doesn't make sense to me.
We donated 40 euros to support the server, which rewards us with the perks of VIP+, it's excludes us to have people gain the same rewards for less. Getting a new tag doesn't make up for the 20 euro discount of a new role with all the perks.

For these reasons I think it's best to leave VIP+ as it is.

-1

 

[Davey]

Remove vote commands + reduce the price of VIP+ = an Easy Solution

When would you ever need to use vote commands as VIP+ these days anyways? You make a report on Discord or through the in-game !call feature, and a staff member will be on hid way in 30 seconds. These light moderation commands for VIP+ members are absolutely meaningless in my opinion.

 

[Red]

Remove vote commands + reduce the price of VIP+ = an Easy Solution

When would you ever need to use vote commands as VIP+ these days anyways? You make a report on Discord or through the in-game !call feature, and a staff member will be on its way in 30 seconds. These light moderation commands for VIP+ members are absolutely meaningless in my opinion

so not only are we gonna restrict people of their rewards, but we're going to humiliate them for their investment by reducing the price of VIP+?
might be an easy solution but not a good one
this is why I proposed an alternative, over than just reducing the price of VIP+

Post automatically merged: Mar 8, 2020

Active participants of this discussion,

This is only a solution I proposed, which is why I wanted most to also attempt to find one for themselves.
Do not only vote on my solution but propose yours as well, if you feel like implementing a similar change.

Moving on.

However, despite there being non-abusable perks with VIP+, the abusable one's are pretty substantial, being able to vote-kick and vote-ban a player is a VERY abusable thing.

As Kyo has mentioned, a lower price means there's more chance of abusing those perks when it's cheaper and doesn't matter as much.
The higher price, in my eyes, helps discourage people from abusing their perks.

It's not a matter of price, as people still have voting rights, even at normal VIP.
So logically, if someone were to abuse, they'd just get the 6 dollar VIP over VIP+.
A new VIP rank in-between wouldn't make the difference.

We donated 40 euros to support the server, which rewards us with the perks of VIP+, it's excludes us to have people gain the same rewards for less. Getting a new tag doesn't make up for the 20 euro discount of a new role with all the perks.

This is why I proposed the addition of more perks to the MVP rank so that the new VIP+ wouldn't be a cheaper MVP with the same rewards.
And maybe it isn't the best idea to give new VIP+ donors 2 of the old VIP+ rank's attributes.
What I wanted was a rank that wasn't permanent, nor expensive as hell.